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How does Clemson keep coaches?

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    How does Clemson keep coaches?

    We know about Venables.

    Jeff Scott (co-OC, WR coach) -- on staff since 2008
    Danny Pearman (TE coach, ST coordinator) -- on staff since 2008
    Tony Elliott (co-OC, RB coach) -- on staff since 2011
    Robbie Caldwell (OL coach) -- on staff since 2011
    Mike Reed (CB coach) -- on staff since 2013
    Brandon Streeter (QB coach, recruiting coordinator) -- on staff since 2014
    Lemanski Hall (DE coach) -- on staff since 2015
    Mickey Conn (safeties coach) -- on staff since January 2016
    Todd Bates (DL coach) -- on staff since January 2017

    Think about the list of players several of these guys have produced.

    Isn't Clemson now at a level where they should get poached like Alabama? As the NCAA currently stands, this is the *only* natural check on championship programs in the feedback loop of spending money and recruiting and winning. It's bitten Bama pretty hard and continues with Enos to Miami. Seems like anyone who's been within 50 miles of Tuscaloosa has blank checks handed to them from half a dozen P5 schools. Why is that not happening to Dabo?

    #2
    God power.

    Comment


      #3
      For one thing they pay their assistants very well. Brent makes 2+ mil a year. Clemson was I believe the first school to pay a coordinator (Chad Morris) a million dollars a year. So they kinda started this whole arms race thing w/coordinators. Brent has had opportunities but maybe their success is more the sum of their parts than individual, dynamic personalities that interview well for HC jobs.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by Loose Shoes View Post
        For one thing they pay their assistants very well. Brent makes 2+ mil a year. Clemson was I believe the first school to pay a coordinator (Chad Morris) a million dollars a year. So they kinda started this whole arms race thing w/coordinators. Brent has had opportunities but maybe their success is more the sum of their parts than individual, dynamic personalities that interview well for HC jobs.
        They like collecting headstones.

        Comment


          #5
          I think one of the keys to being a successful HC in CFB is retaining high quality staff. Maybe Dabo has figured this out. As a matter of fact, I once wrote this note to myself:

          College Coaching Keys:

          1. Recruit players
          2. Recruit and retain staff
          3. Develop a play book to optimize your perennial talent
          4. Develop players
          5. Prep for games

          Comment


            #6


            When you:
            1) win your conference, dominate it...
            2) a majority of the nation respects ACC wins enough to place Tigers in CFP/ win that, coaches will stay...

            Dabo Swinney joins Dean Smith and Mike Krzyzewski as unknown ...

            https://www.newsobserver.com/sports/...224239435.html
            6 hours ago - Dabo Swinney joins Dean Smith and Mike Krzyzewski as unknown hires who rose to the top ... Yet it is difficult to believe there are three lesser-name hires who eventually climbed to the top of their respective professions, ...
            Last edited by kopp0e; 01-11-2019, 08:36 PM.

            Comment


              #7
              The main thing is that Clemson has a lake.

              Comment


                #8
                Dabo is special

                Comment


                  #9

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Originally posted by flatsix View Post
                    I think one of the keys to being a successful HC in CFB is retaining high quality staff. Maybe Dabo has figured this out. As a matter of fact, I once wrote this note to myself:

                    College Coaching Keys:

                    1. Recruit players
                    2. Recruit and retain staff
                    3. Develop a play book to optimize your perennial talent
                    4. Develop players
                    5. Prep for games
                    The question is how Swinney can "retain" his superbly successful staff. As long as you are able to "retain" your thriving staff all other keys you mentioned (recruiting, talent development, game strategy) are well within reach.

                    No matter how much you pay your DB coach when a P5 programs come knocking at his door with a DC offer he'll be nuts not to take it. Why would anyone turn down an opportunity to raise to the top? It goes against the competitive nature of sports. Worst case scenario he'll be back in a coordinator position.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Hey ESPN, no take backs on this "hot take" that went wrong...

                      Comment


                        #12

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Free Electron View Post

                          The question is how Swinney can "retain" his superbly successful staff. As long as you are able to "retain" your thriving staff all other keys you mentioned (recruiting, talent development, game strategy) are well within reach.

                          No matter how much you pay your DB coach when a P5 programs come knocking at his door with a DC offer he'll be nuts not to take it. Why would anyone turn down an opportunity to raise to the top? It goes against the competitive nature of sports. Worst case scenario he'll be back in a coordinator position.
                          First of all -- I will admit I have not had a position of responsibility any similar to HC of a major CFB program. Having said that..

                          There are other things than opportunity and money that motivate people. Sometimes I think some assistants can be retained because they are HAPPY. Others because they don't feel they are READY. Others because they think they are LEARNING and GROWING. Long term goals may matter -- not all coaches seek to be HCs. So it depends upon the individuals and where they are in their professional growth and development. Their relationship with the HC is also important.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Originally posted by Ruprecht View Post
                            The main thing is that Clemson has a lake.
                            And a slide.





                            In all seriousness, Dabo appears to be a stand up guy to work for. Saban seems like he is a motherfucking prick. Programs cull from Alabama all the time, but there might be the possibility that people just get tired of Saban's shit and move on when they get the chance.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by Tobias 2.0 View Post
                              In all seriousness, Dabo appears to be a stand up guy to work for. Saban seems like he is a motherfucking prick. Programs cull from Alabama all the time, but there might be the possibility that people just get tired of Saban's shit and move on when they get the chance.
                              I think you hit on something here

                              Comment


                                #16
                                Originally posted by AppySooner View Post
                                How does Clemson Keep Coaches ?

                                Comment


                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by Ruprecht View Post
                                  The main thing is that Clemson has a lake.
                                  I see what you did there...lol

                                  ND has a gorgeous lake. Was Clemson's lake ever in a movie????

                                  OU has duck pond that is pretty impressive too. I used to have to walk by it every day while i parked my car in front of it despite having a parking sticker that cost me a $100 but had no place to park that was actually on campus....but I digress.

                                  ND doesn't even win a lot of games and they've been through quite a bit of coaches/coordinators as well...two of which who are currently on OU's staff, one on TAM and one is the Chicago Bears Oline coach.

                                  Comment


                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by flatsix View Post

                                    First of all -- I will admit I have not had a position of responsibility any similar to HC of a major CFB program. Having said that..

                                    There are other things than opportunity and money that motivate people. Sometimes I think some assistants can be retained because they are HAPPY. Others because they don't feel they are READY. Others because they think they are LEARNING and GROWING. Long term goals may matter -- not all coaches seek to be HCs. So it depends upon the individuals and where they are in their professional growth and development. Their relationship with the HC is also important.
                                    I know it is hard to believe but some people prefer doing other things besides being a head coach. Years ago before salaries got so out of hand coordinators would stay somewhere for years just happy to do what they loved to do.

                                    Comment


                                      #19
                                      Brent talks about the culture Dabo has created at Clemson. And winning...winning a lot really helps.

                                      Comment


                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by Tobias 2.0 View Post

                                        And a slide.





                                        In all seriousness, Dabo appears to be a stand up guy to work for. Saban seems like he is a motherfucking prick. Programs cull from Alabama all the time, but there might be the possibility that people just get tired of Saban's shit and move on when they get the chance.
                                        I'm sure there's a lot of that involved. Still, you'd expect guys who've produced monster skill players and NCs but share "co" titles and make $850k to at least be mentioned when big jobs come open. I've never heard their names before. Had to look them up.

                                        Maybe you just have to be a certain type of person to work with Dabo every day. If you have a cynical bone in your body, he'd drive you out of your mind.

                                        Comment


                                          #21
                                          It’s been awhile since I was there but it is really beautiful. Mountains, that lake, and it is not overpopulated but looked like great place to live.

                                          Comment


                                            #22
                                            Originally posted by AppySooner View Post

                                            Maybe you just have to be a certain type of person to work with Dabo every day. If you have a cynical bone in your body, he'd drive you out of your mind.
                                            Dabo reminds me of every early 30s aged HS coach I've ever met who is in his first head coaching job. Sort of the loveable ex jock dip shit who never grew up. Certainly not dumb but never spent any time contemplating the universe either. The kind of guy that would tease the Mike Leaches of the world in high school.

                                            Comment


                                              #23
                                              Originally posted by flatsix View Post

                                              First of all -- I will admit I have not had a position of responsibility any similar to HC of a major CFB program. Having said that..

                                              There are other things than opportunity and money that motivate people. Sometimes I think some assistants can be retained because they are HAPPY. Others because they don't feel they are READY. Others because they think they are LEARNING and GROWING. Long term goals may matter -- not all coaches seek to be HCs. So it depends upon the individuals and where they are in their professional growth and development. Their relationship with the HC is also important.
                                              Why do you want to LEARN and GROW? Ultimately to take the next step, but how can you take the next step if you are unwilling to take another job? Are you going to wait like 20 years for Swinney to retire and then fight against other coordinators to take his job? I get that Clemson pays well, Swinney seems like a personable and likable dude, Clemson keeps winning, etc etc... but none of these really explain why Clemson is so good at holding on to their assistants. Lack of ambition goes against the "competition" which is the very nature of sports especially football.

                                              Comment


                                                #24
                                                They pay the fuck out of them...

                                                Comment


                                                  #25
                                                  Dabo is the ultimate CEO coach. He knows he's not the greatest X's and O's guy, and he's not threatened by people that know more than he does. Dabo is good at the people stuff: organizing his staff, recruiting, schmoozing with boosters, making everyone feel important and giving them the tools they need to succeed.

                                                  He has also surrounded himself with people that want to be there, many with Clemson ties.

                                                  Coordinators:
                                                  Brent Venables: We know Brent. He's making $2.1M with half the pressure of a head coach. He likes it there.

                                                  Tony Elliott (co-offensive coordinator): Walked on as a WR at Clemson, ended up being team captain. Earned a degree in industrial engineering and went to work as an engineer for Michelin before getting into coaching. Won Broyles Award as national assistant coach of the year in 2017. He has a good thing going at Clemson.

                                                  Jeff Scott (co-offensive coordinator): Son of former South Carolina coach Brad Scott. Played WR at Clemson after his dad was fired from USCe and was hired as an assistant at Clemson. Coached a high school team to a state championship in their first year as a school and his first year as a head coach. Ended up at Clemson as a graduate assistant and worked his way up. He likes it where he is, too.

                                                  The two offensive coordinators played together at Clemson under Tommy Bowden. Ironically, Dabo coached under Bowden and later replaced him.

                                                  Those guys will eventually leave. Clemson pays well enough and has a great work environment, so they're not in a huge hurry to get out. They can afford to wait for a good job.

                                                  I took a side trip to Clemson last year when I was in that part of the country for work. It's 10 miles off the interstate, but it feels further off the beaten path. The town makes Stillwater look huge. But, it's on a lake, it's close to mountains, and it's close to lots of recruits in the Carolinas and Georgia. And, it's a good school. It's the kind of place where their people want to return and stay.

                                                  Comment


                                                    #26
                                                    Originally posted by Free Electron View Post

                                                    Why do you want to LEARN and GROW? Ultimately to take the next step, but how can you take the next step if you are unwilling to take another job? Are you going to wait like 20 years for Swinney to retire and then fight against other coordinators to take his job? I get that Clemson pays well, Swinney seems like a personable and likable dude, Clemson keeps winning, etc etc... but none of these really explain why Clemson is so good at holding on to their assistants. Lack of ambition goes against the "competition" which is the very nature of sports especially football.
                                                    I didn't mean to learn and grow one's entire career. But spending some time learning and growing is a good way to avoid failure at the next step. So someone might not take an HC position for some time to be better prepared at another time.

                                                    I think there are some good examples of young coaches who really weren't ready when they got their first HC job. Some maybe were never going to ready -- but there are some that really made missteps taking a HC position prematurely.

                                                    Comment


                                                      #27
                                                      The real question will come when Saban retires. You know Bama will come hard after Dabo. Can they pry him away back to his alma mater? Will be interesting for sure.

                                                      Comment


                                                        #28
                                                        Originally posted by Triple B View Post
                                                        The real question will come when Saban retires. You know Bama will come hard after Dabo. Can they pry him away back to his alma mater? Will be interesting for sure.
                                                        Man. That will be a tough act to follow.

                                                        Comment


                                                          #29
                                                          Originally posted by Free Electron View Post

                                                          Why do you want to LEARN and GROW? Ultimately to take the next step, but how can you take the next step if you are unwilling to take another job? Are you going to wait like 20 years for Swinney to retire and then fight against other coordinators to take his job? I get that Clemson pays well, Swinney seems like a personable and likable dude, Clemson keeps winning, etc etc... but none of these really explain why Clemson is so good at holding on to their assistants. Lack of ambition goes against the "competition" which is the very nature of sports especially football.
                                                          Not everyone wants to take the next step and that is in all professions. Not everyone wants the keys to the trash truck , many are content to ride shotgun. My best friend for years was an offensive coordinator for a pee wee team. Every year they asked him to be a head coach and every year he refused. He said I'm doing what I enjoy and being a head coach is a completely different job and not one I chose to do.

                                                          Comment


                                                            #30
                                                            Originally posted by Free Electron View Post
                                                            Why do you want to LEARN and GROW? Ultimately to take the next step, but how can you take the next step if you are unwilling to take another job?
                                                            Which assistant coach got bigger after leaving OU both in media attention and program perception?

                                                            Is Chuck Long known more for what he did at OU as a coordinator or as the head coach of San Diego State?

                                                            Maybe some guys just want to be the best in a field. Brent Venables might just want to focus solely on defense, strives to improve what he has done, and doesn't even want to think about offense. It's possible Dabo has created an environment for those kind of people to come in and thrive. In his interview Venables mentioned the family environment and small town feel. It's also possible Dabo has tried to create an environment that the people under him just love going to work.

                                                            Comment


                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by AZsooner View Post
                                                              It’s been awhile since I was there but it is really beautiful. Mountains, that lake, and it is not overpopulated but looked like great place to live.
                                                              I found to similar to Stillwater, but with more white supremacy. It’s very far from a big city.

                                                              Comment


                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by Free Electron View Post

                                                                Why do you want to LEARN and GROW? Ultimately to take the next step, but how can you take the next step if you are unwilling to take another job? Are you going to wait like 20 years for Swinney to retire and then fight against other coordinators to take his job? I get that Clemson pays well, Swinney seems like a personable and likable dude, Clemson keeps winning, etc etc... but none of these really explain why Clemson is so good at holding on to their assistants. Lack of ambition goes against the "competition" which is the very nature of sports especially football.
                                                                The flip side of that is the Peter Principle that many coaches (and people everywhere) fall for. The next level up may be a growth path for some, but it may be diversion away from the job that provides real satisfaction for others. And if you don't love your job, you're probably going to suck at it. It's not unusually to see coaches happily being coordinators after having some tough stints as HCs.

                                                                Comment


                                                                  #33
                                                                  Originally posted by Velo Sooner View Post

                                                                  The flip side of that is the Peter Principle that many coaches (and people everywhere) fall for. The next level up may be a growth path for some, but it may be diversion away from the job that provides real satisfaction for others. And if you don't love your job, you're probably going to suck at it. It's not unusually to see coaches happily being coordinators after having some tough stints as HCs.
                                                                  yeah. I keep hearing the same response from everyone here: "some coaches don't care about promotion and want to do what they enjoy under Dabo. want to have job security, don't feel they are ready for the next step etc etc ..."

                                                                  But why do literally ALL CLEMSON COORDINATORS fall under this category which is not common at all. Look other successful programs like Ohio State, Bama, etc...

                                                                  Comment


                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by Free Electron View Post

                                                                    yeah. I keep hearing the same response from everyone here: "some coaches don't care about promotion and want to do what they enjoy under Dabo. want to have job security, don't feel they are ready for the next step etc etc ..."

                                                                    But why do literally ALL CLEMSON COORDINATORS fall under this category which is not common at all. Look other successful programs like Ohio State, Bama, etc...
                                                                    Dabo keeps them gruntled. We all know a dis-gruntled employee is the most likely to leave.

                                                                    Comment


                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by Triple B View Post
                                                                      The real question will come when Saban retires. You know Bama will come hard after Dabo. Can they pry him away back to his alma mater? Will be interesting for sure.
                                                                      I don't think they can. Not because of money, facilities, bagmen, whatever. It's going to be very difficult for anyone to follow Saban, for you are going to be measured against him all the time. I believe Dabo is smart enough to avoid that trap.

                                                                      Comment


                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by OKIRISHFAN View Post

                                                                        I see what you did there...lol

                                                                        ND has a gorgeous lake. Was Clemson's lake ever in a movie????

                                                                        OU has duck pond that is pretty impressive too. I used to have to walk by it every day while i parked my car in front of it despite having a parking sticker that cost me a $100 but had no place to park that was actually on campus....but I digress.

                                                                        ND doesn't even win a lot of games and they've been through quite a bit of coaches/coordinators as well...two of which who are currently on OU's staff, one on TAM and one is the Chicago Bears Oline coach.
                                                                        PHKOFF, domer.

                                                                        Comment


                                                                          #37
                                                                          Clempsun pays guys enough to not make premature evacuations (aka taking East Popcorn State jobs). They’ve got a good staff that has been on hand for awhile now to really build something special. Stability and patience to get there makes a huge difference.

                                                                          Comment


                                                                            #38
                                                                            No different that big business. Culture. They're treated good. They like what they do. They have little interest in head coaching for a no name university. Apparently good chemistry between all of them.

                                                                            Comment


                                                                              #39
                                                                              Let's quit beating around the bush... Dabo has serious blackmail on all these guys and uses it. Don't let the God talk fool you.

                                                                              Comment


                                                                                #40
                                                                                ......I got nothing

                                                                                SS

                                                                                Comment


                                                                                  #41
                                                                                  Originally posted by Triple B View Post
                                                                                  The real question will come when Saban retires. You know Bama will come hard after Dabo. Can they pry him away back to his alma mater? Will be interesting for sure.
                                                                                  Why would he take a step down to coach at Alabama. He's doing great where he's at, he's created his own powerhouse.

                                                                                  Comment


                                                                                    #42
                                                                                    Originally posted by Mazeppa View Post

                                                                                    Why would he take a step down to coach at Alabama. He's doing great where he's at, he's created his own powerhouse.
                                                                                    He’s a bama grad and that whole bubba gump routine fits in with their inbred culture.

                                                                                    Comment


                                                                                      #43
                                                                                      Originally posted by SoonerHank View Post

                                                                                      He’s a bama grad and that whole bubba gump routine fits in with their inbred culture.
                                                                                      thats all i got to saya bout thot.

                                                                                      Comment


                                                                                        #44
                                                                                        Originally posted by Triple B View Post
                                                                                        The real question will come when Saban retires. You know Bama will come hard after Dabo. Can they pry him away back to his alma mater? Will be interesting for sure.
                                                                                        Dabo's not going home.

                                                                                        No one wants to be the man that followed the man. This is especially true at Alabama. There were six coaches between Paul Bryant and Nick Saban. Only Gene Stallings won a national championship (with a team Dabo played for). Saban had to win five NCs in order to become Bryant's equal in the eyes of Alabama fans. Dabo's a Bama guy, and he knows Bama well enough that he'd never have it as good there as he does at Clemson.

                                                                                        Comment


                                                                                          #45
                                                                                          Originally posted by RockFlagandEagle View Post
                                                                                          God power.
                                                                                          True power of "Thoughts and Prayer" is strong in Death Valley.

                                                                                          Comment


                                                                                            #46
                                                                                            Maybe the staff are all scientologist. You don't leave scientology.

                                                                                            Comment


                                                                                              #47
                                                                                              Winning championships due to Bag Men & PEDs without repercussion in a 1-team conference while paying the staff millions of dollars = complete staff retention

                                                                                              Comment


                                                                                                #48
                                                                                                No... No... Clemson keeps it's staff intact from what heff mentioned, as well as fancy boxed lunches when you win the CFP title...
                                                                                                Now, I imagine if Oklahoma had won the title this year, the team would have prepared lunch from Whataburger/ In-N-Out, & Rally's; based on OU recruiting...


                                                                                                Comment


                                                                                                  #49
                                                                                                  This guy gets it:

                                                                                                  Comment


                                                                                                    #50
                                                                                                    A music artist in Atlanta offered to throw Dabo & Tigers a "proper celebration": (a party as such has to make recruiting easier for coaches, of athletes in region)...

                                                                                                    Comment

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